Online Now 2322

Horns247 Board

The place to talk about the Texas Longhorns

On this Board 1019
Record: 4156 (12/1/2012)

Online now 1932
Record: 7224 (2/22/2012)

Boards ▾

Horns247 Board

The place to talk about the Texas Longhorns

6th Street

The place for off topic discussion on Hookem

Reply

***Hoops: Texas-NC State -- FINAL***

  • austinr said...

    clack...........we understand you don't like Rick Barnes and you can say Barnes should not have recruited Brown because he had that rep in HS but that is where is stops. You played ..........this is a young team and young teams play inconsistent. I am really disappointed because we should be 4-0. However Texas was the most talented of the 4 teams in NJ this weekend..............however this points to the fact that J' Covan will have great stats this year and will put us in a position to win will not close the deal. He is a great FT shooter but at important times hotdogs at the line. He has done that his entire career. He is not dependable.............It is going to be very interesting to see how this team bounces back. I just keep thinking we need to get to 9-10 wins before conference.

    Love Rick Barnes personally.
    Not a big fan as a game coach.

    Never said or thought Texas should not have recruited J'Covan Brown.
    I am glad to have him on the team.
    He is who he is.

    That doesn't mean it is not fair to criticize him/Rick after their performance the past two games.
    I outlined my thoughts on the Oregon State game in that thread.

    Tonight Rick -

    1) Stayed in the zone again after teams are scoring at probably an 80 percent clip
    2) Never called TO's to stunt their run (Pitino or Izzo would have called like 9 - see Louisville's first round game in the 2011 tourney as an example)
    3) Never made an effort to get this team to run a simple offensive set to get a good shot with under ten minutes left.
    4) Did a great job in screaming at his team not to foul late in the game which he made the mistake of in Saturday's game (which I highlighted in the game thread and which I also gave him credit for in this thread previously)

    But your opinion is just as valid as mine and your points are well taken.

    signature image signature image signature image

    clacknasty ●

  • austinr said...

    A fact missed by the some posters................I bet we have not even practiced zone at all this season. That will come during the Christmas break............

    It might have been the right defense given the circumstances, but not for this team. That was red meat for the opposition. Played right into their wheelhouse. Surely someone on our bench, and this board, scouted NCS besides me.

    TXStampede

  • clacknasty said...

    Love Rick Barnes personally. Not a big fan as a game coach.

    Never said or thought Texas should not have recruited J'Covan Brown. I am glad to have him on the team. He is who he is.

    That doesn't mean it is not fair to criticize him/Rick after their performance the past two games. I outlined my thoughts on the Oregon State game in that thread.

    Tonight Rick -

    1) Stayed in the zone again after teams are scoring at probably an 80 percent clip 2) Never called TO's to stunt their run (Pitino or Izzo would have called like 9 - see Louisville's first round game in the 2011 tourney as an example) 3) Never made an effort to get this team to run a simple offensive set to get a good shot with under ten minutes left. 4) Did a great job in screaming at his team not to foul late in the game which he made the mistake of in Saturday's game (which I highlighted in the game thread and which I also gave him credit for in this thread previously)

    But your opinion is just as valid as mine and your points are well taken.

    The time out is a fair point............but the zone was a must or we would have about 2 players playing at the 3 min mark. There are times I wonder if J'Covan is worth it .............he is an offensive machine and really is very unselfish but like I posted earlier not sure he is closer. I bet at the end of a half or game is FT% is about 50% if you tracked it for the 2+ years here. He has way too much street ball in him for my taste at times.

    BTW don't you think the offensive issues would have looked better if Brown were in the game?

    "Leadership is wisdom, courage and great carelessness of self"

    austinr

  • austinr said...

    BTW don't you think the offensive issues would have looked better if Brown were in the game?

    Unfortunately most of the offense was based on J'Covan doing everything out of iso sets.
    When you are that reliant on one person to do everything instead of getting everyone involved out of base sets like they did in the first half you see what you saw when he left the game.

    signature image signature image signature image

    clacknasty ●

  • I really don't think a lot of people realize how good this team can be. It can be better then has been predicted here. They lost to Oregon State because of lack of communication and inexperience. Tonight though they lost because of a self absorbed brat who let his teammates down and is completely responsible for this loss. Tomorrow he will have some excuse that makes no sense. Whether he grows up or not will decide the season. Coach Barnes was pretty hard on him after the game.

    Jordan91

  • Another disappointing loss to a flat out average NCst team. Let me be clear about this, NCst is going to finish in the bottom half of the ACC.

    Texas had outplayed and outhustled them the entire night until J'Covan Brown decides to revert to being 16 years old. 4th foul...mouths off to the officials and gets a technical.

    I was wondering when something like this was going to happen.

    Ok...to our "fans" that want to criticize Barnes...please just go kill yourself.

    Barnes has done an absolutely fantastic job with getting the 6 freshman ready to play major D1 ball. Defensively they are terrible...that's the way most freshman play. They've never had to play a lick of great defense in their lives...now they are learning. Rebounding wise, they were a little better tonight, but they need to get much stronger in the weightroom.

    HOWEVER PLEASE UNDERSTAND AND READ CAREFULLY...Texas is not going to win very many games by playing 6 freshman plus having Chapman and Wang manning the post.

    I think that 15 wins will be the high water mark for this team. Once the scouting report gets out, teams will be all over J'Covan Brown.

    As for the freshman, Holmes, Lewis, and McClennan are all playing quite well offensively. Kabongo looks a little tired already and a little indecisive. He needs another year of college to hone his skills.

    In any case, I hope all of our "fickle" and spoiled fans jump ship and never come back. This group is going to be very, very good in 2 years...heck...maybe next year.

    horn1chris ●

  • horn1chris said...

    Another disappointing loss to a flat out average NCst team. Let me be clear about this, NCst is going to finish in the bottom half of the ACC.

    Texas had outplayed and outhustled them the entire night until J'Covan Brown decides to revert to being 16 years old. 4th foul...mouths off to the officials and gets a technical.

    I was wondering when something like this was going to happen.

    Ok...to our "fans" that want to criticize Barnes...please just go kill yourself.

    Barnes has done an absolutely fantastic job with getting the 6 freshman ready to play major D1 ball. Defensively they are terrible...that's the way most freshman play. They've never had to play a lick of great defense in their lives...now they are learning. Rebounding wise, they were a little better tonight, but they need to get much stronger in the weightroom.

    HOWEVER PLEASE UNDERSTAND AND READ CAREFULLY...Texas is not going to win very many games by playing 6 freshman plus having Chapman and Wang manning the post.

    I think that 15 wins will be the high water mark for this team. Once the scouting report gets out, teams will be all over J'Covan Brown.

    As for the freshman, Holmes, Lewis, and McClennan are all playing quite well offensively. Kabongo looks a little tired already and a little indecisive. He needs another year of college to hone his skills.

    In any case, I hope all of our "fickle" and spoiled fans jump ship and never come back. This group is going to be very, very good in 2 years...heck...maybe next year.

    +1
    I think this team is going to be fine this year also......................chris the only thing I would correct is the comment about some of our fans. I actually this most of the stuff posted is fair.

    "Leadership is wisdom, courage and great carelessness of self"

    austinr

  • horn1chris said...

    In any case, I hope all of our "fickle" and spoiled fans jump ship and never come back. This group is going to be very, very good in 2 years...heck...maybe next year.

    Texas fans are not known for their patience, no matter the sport. I think there is a lot of frustration now because our two major sports are in a rebuilding mode at the same time. Nevertheless, it is fairly typical for that impatience to be expressed as criticism of the coach, followed by demands that he be fired.

    Spoiled was probably the optimum word in your post, because many of our fans believe that Texas should never have a sub-par year in any sport. It's unrealistic, but that's what some people think. The last time we had to rely on this many freshmen, one of them was KD. Even then, our only hope of winning most games was to simply outscore the opponent, since we couldn't defend or rebound very well. There is no KD in this bunch to average 25 points per game, or take over in lengthy stretches.

    That means there is going to be frustration ahead. This will not be the last time we are unable to hold a lead, because the young players foul too much, and no clear leader has emerged to guide the team through the rough spots. Any hope that JB might have become that player seems to be a pipe dream. It will have to be someone else.

    Even so, there is no reason to abandon the team. It will be fun to watch them develop, that is, when I am actually able to watch.

    texaztom

  • austinr said...

    +1 I think this team is going to be fine this year also......................chris the only thing I would correct is the comment about some of our fans. I actually this most of the stuff posted is fair.

    uh yeah...i'm not sure what anyone said that would warrant a "go kill yourself" huh

    austen

  • texaztom said...

    Even so, there is no reason to abandon the team. It will be fun to watch them develop, that is, when I am actually able to watch.

    Have you tried looking at the replays?

    “Kansas may wind up number one in these polls, but that would be so unfair to Texas...” -- Len Elmore, 2/13/11

    Bob in Houston

  • horn1chris said...

    Another disappointing loss to a flat out average NCst team. Let me be clear about this, NCst is going to finish in the bottom half of the ACC.

    Texas had outplayed and outhustled them the entire night until J'Covan Brown decides to revert to being 16 years old. 4th foul...mouths off to the officials and gets a technical.

    I was wondering when something like this was going to happen.

    Ok...to our "fans" that want to criticize Barnes...please just go kill yourself.

    Barnes has done an absolutely fantastic job with getting the 6 freshman ready to play major D1 ball. Defensively they are terrible...that's the way most freshman play. They've never had to play a lick of great defense in their lives...now they are learning. Rebounding wise, they were a little better tonight, but they need to get much stronger in the weightroom.

    HOWEVER PLEASE UNDERSTAND AND READ CAREFULLY...Texas is not going to win very many games by playing 6 freshman plus having Chapman and Wang manning the post.

    I think that 15 wins will be the high water mark for this team. Once the scouting report gets out, teams will be all over J'Covan Brown.

    As for the freshman, Holmes, Lewis, and McClennan are all playing quite well offensively. Kabongo looks a little tired already and a little indecisive. He needs another year of college to hone his skills.

    In any case, I hope all of our "fickle" and spoiled fans jump ship and never come back. This group is going to be very, very good in 2 years...heck...maybe next year.

    15 games? What are you basing this on? It can't be the first four games because if you watched those you would never say they would win only 15 games

    Jordan91

  • This was one of those games that I think we're going to see a few more times. Have it going their way and then, suddenly, it's gone.

    You could just see, while Barnes was pointedly explaining to J'Covan what he'd just done, that suddenly, they were rudderless. Kabongo looked like he'd never run the point before, and nobody knew how to get open without J'Covan to draw an extra defender.

    But it was better to do this now than six weeks from now, even though it probably will happen again in conference play a time or two.

    And, somehow, I get this positive vibe from Barnes. It's almost like he's taking this as a challenge. I'm thinking of it more in the '99 mode, when they started so badly, than the '07, when RB knew he'd be able to throw the team on KD and KD could handle it.

    If they could figure out how not to reach and push with such regularity, they win this game easily. They would have won the other one, too. But I'm still seeing (what I consider) some odd rotations by the bigs that have opened the weak side for easy putbacks. I don't know what they do there.

    “Kansas may wind up number one in these polls, but that would be so unfair to Texas...” -- Len Elmore, 2/13/11

    Bob in Houston

  • UCLA hit its last two three point attempts to finally take the lead over Chaminade at the half, 40-38. UCLA is now 9-49 on the year on three-pointers. Think we could run a zone against them?

    bierce

  • austen said...

    Barnes not mincing words about J'covan in the postgame with Craig. Said it was unfair to his teammates, that they've worked too hard, big part of us losing, he let down his teammates. Craig asked Barnes if J'covan was saying something to himself, Barnes said it doesn't matter, he knows better.

    Let me not mince words. Barnes costs his teams 2-3 games annually with his flat out refusal to call time outs to stop runs. If he's going to blame J'Covan, he can blame himself too. It's not "fair" that Barnes refuses to use all tools at his disposal to asiat his team Plus, let's be clear. J'Covan did not explode. He probably said something and could have said nothing but he certainly didn't force the ref to call a tech from what I saw. Nothing is black and white here.

    This post was edited by DLev on 11/21/2011 at 9:47 PM

    DLev ●

  • Bob in Houston said...

    Have you tried looking at the replays?

    Would love to. Where?

    texaztom

  • DLev said...

    Let me not mince words. Barnes costs his teams 2-3 games annually with his flat out refusal to call time outs to stop runs. If he's going to blame J'Covan, he can blame himself too. It's not "fair" that Barnes refuses to use all tools at his disposal to asiat his team Plus, let's be clear. J'Covan did not explode. He probably said something and could have said nothing but he certainly didn't force the ref to call a tech from what I saw. Nothing is black and white here.

    Bull $hit!

    "Leadership is wisdom, courage and great carelessness of self"

    austinr

  • 'What Can Brown Do For You?' When he's out.......

    signature image
    signature image
     signature image

    "Don't know. Never had one" -- D. Royal-Mack Brown how to coach a team after a losing season

    Bruce7

  • austinr said...

    Bull $hit!

    I love Barnes, but I find it ridiculous that he demands growth from his players but has made the same stupid mistakes for a decade. I guarantee you are in the minority of fans that follow the team closely if you think Barnes does an even passable job utilizing his timeouts.

    DLev ●

  • You guys act like calling a timeout is a magic cure for poor play. Like all of a sudden the other team will just stop kicking your ass because you called a timeout. It's a very overrated action.

    Sometimes it's necessary in order to calm your team down, or make major adjustments, but most of the time you want your team to work through it so that everytime the other team goes on a run they aren't looking to the sideline for some magical timeout.

    Phil Jackson hardly ever calls a timeout when the other team makes a run. He trusts his team, and it's leaders, to step up.

    And to whoever said that the team doesn't work on zone until Christmas, wow! Just stop posting on the basketball threads because you are VERY ignorant. There is NOTHING that the team hasn't worked on at this point. How much the freshmen are able to retain, or translate to live action, may be limited but they have worked on everything multiple times.

    HoopsCoach

  • most coaches stop the momentum with a timeout. Calming your team down and adjustments do that for you. Having your team work through it will lose you games against a good team because as Rick says all the time, "They aint gonna stop"

    Phil doesn't call timeouts because he had Jordan, Shaq and Kobe.

    rantanamo

  • HoopsCoach said...

    You guys act like calling a timeout is a magic cure for poor play. Like all of a sudden the other team will just stop kicking your ass because you called a timeout. It's a very overrated action.

    Sometimes it's necessary in order to calm your team down, or make major adjustments, but most of the time you want your team to work through it so that everytime the other team goes on a run they aren't looking to the sideline for some magical timeout.

    Phil Jackson hardly ever calls a timeout when the other team makes a run. He trusts his team, and it's leaders, to step up.

    And to whoever said that the team doesn't work on zone until Christmas, wow! Just stop posting on the basketball threads because you are VERY ignorant. There is NOTHING that the team hasn't worked on at this point. How much the freshmen are able to retain, or translate to live action, may be limited but they have worked on everything multiple times.

    Tom Izzo, Roy Williams, Bill Self, Rick Pitino. I really don't care what Phil Jackson does in the NBA. Every one of the college coaches I've just listed is a master of stopping the opposing team from going on a long run by calling a timeout no later than the third straight sloppy offensive possession. It's a proven strategy that gets results. I cannot think of a single anecdotal example from the last ten years where Barnes' teams have shown improved ability to fight off a run late in the season that can be attributed to refusing to call a timeout early in the season.

    DLev ●

  • texaztom said...

    Would love to. Where?

    Go back to espn3 and click on Replay.

    Now, if you just don't have access to espn3, you're out of luck. But I can't think of a reason that you couldn't access it now if you do.

    “Kansas may wind up number one in these polls, but that would be so unfair to Texas...” -- Len Elmore, 2/13/11

    Bob in Houston

  • DLev said...

    Tom Izzo, Roy Williams, Bill Self, Rick Pitino. I really don't care what Phil Jackson does in the NBA. Every one of the college coaches I've just listed is a master of stopping the opposing team from going on a long run by calling a timeout no later than the third straight sloppy offensive possession. It's a proven strategy that gets results. I cannot think of a single anecdotal example from the last ten years where Barnes' teams have shown improved ability to fight off a run late in the season that can be attributed to refusing to call a timeout early in the season.

    Roy Williams is known throughout Kansas and North Carolina for not calling timeouts to stop runs. He learned from Dean Smith, who agrees with Hoops Coach. If you have something important to say, you call time out and say it, but otherwise, no.

    If this is a proven strategy, I'd like to see the data.

    As for last night, there was a media timeout 40 seconds after Brown got himself fouled out, and he called another one less than a minute after that. The other three were used in the last minute when they were trying to tie it up. What do you want from him?

    This post was edited by Bob in Houston on 11/22/2011 at 11:10 AM

    “Kansas may wind up number one in these polls, but that would be so unfair to Texas...” -- Len Elmore, 2/13/11

    Bob in Houston

  • Bob in Houston said...

    Go back to espn3 and click on Replay.

    Now, if you just don't have access to espn3, you're out of luck. But I can't think of a reason that you couldn't access it now if you do.

    Thanks, but I can't access ESPN3. None of the right internet providers. Someone said it was as simple as setting up an AT&T email account, but that no longer works. They check your carrier before letting you through the portal.

    texaztom

  • Bob in Houston said...

    Roy Williams is known throughout Kansas and North Carolina for not calling timeouts to stop runs. He learned from Dean Smith, who agrees with Hoops Coach. If you have something important to say, you call time out and say it, but otherwise, no.

    If this is a proven strategy, I'd like to see the data.

    As for last night, there was a media timeout 40 seconds after Brown got himself fouled out, and he called another one less than a minute after that. The other three were used in the last minute when they were trying to tie it up. What do you want from him?

    Good point. The timeouts did not stop the NCSU runs. Interestingly, NCSU called timeouts during some Texas runs, and that didn't stop Texas, either.

    texaztom

Texas
247Sports
Features
Resources
Connect

247Sports In partnership with CBS Sports